| Questions, Intuitions, Revisions: Telling and Re-Telling Stories About Ourselves in the World A College Seminar Course at Bryn Mawr College
|
Forum 8- Exploring the Unconscious
Name: Anne Dalke
Username: adalke@brynmawr.edu
Subject: senility and the unconscious
Date: 2003-10-24 07:48:06
Message Id: 6988
Comments:
The rich conversation the McBrides and I had yesterday about the fund of "tacit
knowledge" each of us carries (and we DID have some stories!!) led (among other
things) to our exploring the possibility that, as we age, as we become senile,
as we lose our conscious faculties, what we know unconsciously becomes more
available to us. I was telling a few stories about visits I used to make with
an elderly friend, for whom this certainly seemed to be the case. See, for instance,
Language
Play: Two More Test Cases and
On Losing Categories (the World?).
Name: Flicka
Username: fmichael@brynmawr.edu
Subject: Consciousness vs. Unconsciousness
Date: 2003-10-27 23:51:49
Message Id: 7020
Comments:
There was a very interesting idea in our bio forum about how
consciousness requires more than one person to exist. Do you think thats
true? I think that the ability to be conscious is just something that we have.
It's not something you can describe, it's just there. However, the ability to
be *aware* of our consciousness requires more than one person. In order to be
aware of what you're thinking or what you're doing, you need someone else to
*make* you aware of it. Therefore, the only way humanity has a knowledge of
the unconscious and the conscious is because interactions with other people
have made their thoughts about the subject conscious. Am I making any sense
to anybody?
Name: Webmaster
Username: Serendip
Subject: Forum working again
Date: 2003-10-30 14:27:46
Message Id: 7062
Comments:
The forum wasn't posting comments from Tuesday afternoon till Thursday afternoon. However, the posts you made were logged, and will be restored shortly. Sorry bout this.
Name: Anne Dalke
Username: adalke@brynmawr.edu
Subject: making the unconscious plain
Date: 2003-10-30 14:28:36
Message Id: 7063
Comments:
Somehow...my request, posted Tuesday morning, got lost in the ether of the internet/serendip...
what I had asked, and ask again now: would you tell us, please, what aspect of the unconscious you are exploring? What realm of tacit knowledge you are attempting to make conscious in your current writing project?
Name: Anne Dalke
Username: adalke@brynmawr.edu
Subject: tell, please
Date: 2003-10-30 14:29:01
Message Id: 7064
Comments:
Each of you, this week, please: tell us what aspect of the unconscious you are exploring? We'd all like to hear about the range of tacit knowledge you are bringing into consciousness..
Name: Alicia Jones
Username: ajones@brynmawr.edu
Subject: Tacit Learning Project
Date: 2003-10-30 14:30:03
Message Id: 7065
Comments:
OK - it's late and I'm tired, but I want to post a little info about my "tacit learning" project as per Professor Dalke's request in the McBride class on Tuesday.\nI am doing an unscientific evaluation on how tacit learning or tacit understanding comes into play when one is taking a "timed typing test."
\nSome of you may remember the days when there were no computer keyboards at the tips of everyone's fingers, so we learned to type on an old-fashioned typewriter. I think it is interesting that the image of how the keyboard is set up is always there in my unconcious mind and that when I type on the keyboard my fingers "automatically" know where they are supposed to go. I even know, immediately, when I strike the incorrect key. My unconcious knows what to do and where to reach for the keys on the keyboard, but most times I let my "conscious mind" get in the way and I "think" about the strokes and undoubtedly, I then make mistakes while typing.
\nIn order to write the paper and present some data I'll be performing a series of timed typing tests (and I will not look at the keyboard while typing) over this week to see if I can improve my speed and accuracy by just typing and not thinking about where the keys are and what I'm typing. I have no idea what it will prove in the end, but it seems like a fun and unique way to test my tacit understanding. And, hey, maybe I'll even be a faster typist in the end.
\nGood night all!
\nAlicia
Name: Jenny
Username: jfbarr@brynmawr.edu
Subject: consciousness of consciousness
Date: 2003-10-30 14:30:53
Message Id: 7066
Comments:
To me, Vygotsky's idea of "spread of affect" to explain animal "communication" makes more sense than the idea of animals being aware of their own consciousness. Animals probably have some sense of categories (things to fear, things to eat, etc.), but does the information that they exchange with each other convey anything more specific than the general category itself (the geese calling "danger!")? And does that information exchange go more than one way? Can the other goose ever say, "No, no, calm down, that's not a predator, it's a lawn ornament." \nBut the idea of animals' being able to talk to each other or express their own consciousness is really appealing. There's a great children's book more or less on the subject called "Click Clack Moo, Cows That Type." The cows find an old typewriter and start sending messages to the farmer: "Dear Farmer Brown, The barn is very cold at night. We'd like some electric blankets. Sincerely, The Cows."
\nAnd as for humans... I like the idea that knowledge of consciousness developed through social interactions (ourselves in contrast to and in correspondance with others like ourselves), but I wonder if other people are necessary for our continued awareness of our own consciousness? It seems like the state of senility is a "devolution" back into a lack of awareness of differentiation from the world around you. But that's something that results in, not comes from lack of human contact. Would a hermit living alone at the top of a mountain eventually lose the sense of his own individual consciousness? Is that what they call enlightenment?
Name: karen
Username: kdelnash@brynmawr.edu
Subject: much gibberish
Date: 2003-10-30 14:31:58
Message Id: 7067
Comments:
WARNING: The following is random.(Sorry, being silly. . .)\nCarl Yung if my memory is correct beleived all thoughts in the universe are collected a great "pool". The pool is the source of the unconscious as well as dreams. Perhaps man's common ideas of morality and injustice stems from this pool.
Name: Danielle
Username: Anonymous
Subject:
Date: 2003-10-30 14:32:37
Message Id: 7068
Comments:
I really liked the Pinker reading, particularly "chatterboxes". I thought his connections with William's syndrome was very interesting. In many ways it relates to Anne's question about the consciousness of those of "less" mind capactiy than the fully able human. I personally feel that beings that fall into this catergory are conscious, if in a different way. The human mind is very powerful, but it is also unique; comparing all other minds to ours is not giving full justice. If other people's, or animal's, minds work differently, it does not mean that they are not conscious. Rather, it just means that they are conscious in a different way. Really, this actually isn't even so different from comparing fully able human minds from drastically different societies to the Western mind; so much of our conscious, unconscioous and values are shaped upon society.
Name: Anne Dalke
Username: adalke@brynmawr.edu
Subject: this is NOT about the unconscious
Date: 2003-10-30 14:33:42
Message Id: 7069
Comments:
...but it's what i'm thinking about right now, so t/here!
\nsee \nfree exploration
Name: ginny costello
Username: vcostell
Subject: Thought & knowledge
Date: 2003-11-03 10:39:07
Message Id: 7092
Comments:
Several discussions got me thinking about our minds and how they work. Polanyi's ideas on Tacit Knowledge and how "we know more than we can tell," and Vygotsky's claims that understanding and construction of knowledge is social in origin, and then Anne Dalke's account of her visits to her friend with a failing memory churned up some old questions of mine regarding thought and knowledge. I have a child with a condition known as Downs-Syndrome. Downs-Syndrome people have an extra chromosome which means they are wired differently from the average person. They are mentally retarded. For 30 years I have participated in various studies and efforts to help her to learn. She has been in school since birth, and she has had enormous social interaction. She does not speak a word, yet she can perform very minor sign language. She has had numerous test, yet, no one can discover why she is language impaired. She demonstrates preferences for things, and seems to understand many things I say to her.She sometimes seems to speak through her eyes. I always wonder what is in her conscious mind, and now I wonder if she knows more than she can tell us.
Name: Tamiyo Britton
Username: tbritton@brynmawr.edu
Subject:
Date: 2003-11-03 12:41:36
Message Id: 7093
Comments:
I am still having hard time trying to figure out or try to understand how it is possible to write about tacit learning. Or how is it possible to observe tacit knowledge. But for the moment, I am trying to see how I am learning to play the piano.
Name: Christine Lipuma
Username: clipuma@brynmawr.edu
Subject: Daydreams
Date: 2003-11-04 09:58:01
Message Id: 7102
Comments:
I will be studying daydreams as a pathway into the unconscious. It has been my experience during chemistry that when I don't understand the lecture and drift into a daydream, my brain makes analogies between chemistry and social relationships. It is possible that this is a way that my unconscious makes sense of chemistry, by relating it to familar concepts of life.
Name: Flicka
Username: fmichael@brynmawr.edu
Subject: My Study of the Unconscious
Date: 2003-11-04 17:08:10
Message Id: 7115
Comments:
I am asking people at random points in the day to just start writing. I am asking them to not think before they write or while they are writing, just to start as soon as I hand the paper to them. The results I have so far are interesting. My subjects wrote down a stream of conscious (or unconscious, depending on how you see it) about a paragraph long, and then I analyzed it. I learned a lot about the grammatical aspect of writing and how it relates to your unconscious. In my next paper, I'm going to do more studies using this spontaneous writing method and see if I can uncover other aspets of the unconscious.
PS- I got this idea from writing in the forum, because sometimes I would begin writing without even knowing what I was going to write about, and I would come up with some cool idea that I didn't know was in me. :)
Name: Danielle
Username:
Subject: Unconscious studies
Date: 2003-11-04 17:27:32
Message Id: 7116
Comments:
For the past week, I have been asking people to draw pictures of the homes. The results have proven to be fascinating; because I would not answer any questions as to how to approach the task, the interpretations of the assignmentin themselves are interesting. As for the actual drawings, they range from floor plans of homes, to aerial views of single houses, to whole cities, and are truly captivating pathways into the unconscious.
Name: Alicia Jones
Username: ajones@brynmawr.edu
Subject: Fasinating Tacit Memory Uncovered
Date: 2003-11-06 07:55:52
Message Id: 7138
Comments:
Well, I must say that this digging and probing into the unconscious is pretty darn cool! On Tuesday Prof Dalke and I were discussing my paper on "timed typing tests" and how the unconscious mind retains learned motor skills (such as learning to type) and with her help I "uncovered" a "tacit knowing" about myself that is very reality based. I abhor timed tests, spot quizzes, and actually, tests in general. My tacit memory of them identifies them as being "pure torture." And, I don't think taking them is a confirmed measure of whether or not I have retained anything from the particular educational setting or class that I was in. As a matter of fact, in my research on how the brain learns it is a documented fact that your brain is more likely to store learning that makes sense and has meaning, therefore, just because someone performs well on a test does not mean that they will be the only ones to retain the information.
Just an observation I thought I'd share.
Alicia
Name: angel
Username: Anonymous
Subject:
Date: 2003-11-09 22:25:38
Message Id: 7166
Comments:
I've been observing people who I have come to know quite closely over the span of these few months. I observe how they act and react to the various situations they are faced with. I am trying to find a pattern or a common denominator to define why people act the way they do. A lot of us would agree that some reactions are instinctual, but I think that there are some actions that are instinctual as well, ie they come from the unconscious. I find one example given by Prof. Grobstein important to my point. He talked of how when people were told in a state of hypnosis that there was a table in the middle of the room, they walked around it when they were conscious, even though they did not see it. What is more interesting is that they found alternative reasons as to why they did not walk through the area where they supposed the table was. I think that there are things people do for reasons they themselves dont understand, or reasons that the conscious mind tells them is true as apposed to what is true as per the unconscious. So my theory is that even if you tell someone that they are doing a particular action because of this action, they might acknowledge that but would continue to do it even if you tell them that it is self destructive.
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