Women, Sport, and Film Course
Cosponsored by Athletics and Physical Education at Bryn Mawr College
and the Exercise and Sports Studies Department at Smith College, with
support from the Center for Science In Society at Bryn Mawr College and the
Serendip website.
WEEK 4 - FORUM 4
Name: Amy Campbell
Username: acampbel@brynmawr.edu
Subject: Week 4 Questions
Date: 2003-02-22 09:35:56
Message Id: 4751
Comments:
Please answer one of the three questions:
1. Is it advancement for women in sport, that the main character is the first woman on the cover of SURFING magazine? Why or why not?
2. (Same as week #1) What is the cultural ideal of women in sport? And how does it differ from men?
3. How does this film stereotype the main and supporting characters in this film?
Name:
Username: Anonymous
Subject:
Date: 2003-02-25 16:53:39
Message Id: 4834
Comments:
In response to question #1, I think that it is and it isn't. One the main desires of the lead character of the movie was for a woman to appear on the front of a surfing magazine. It is great then that a woman appeared on the front cover, performing her sport no less! However, I think the folks in my group and I all had issues with the fact that the woman that they did eventually put on the cover happened to be a looker. Sure she was skilled, but certainly not as much as the real deals, the actress does not even surf. The movie is entertaining enough, but in terms of trying to advance the image of women in sports, I think it fails. My personal belief is that this movie was made by men who saw dollar signs in getting cute girls in bathing suits trying to act serious abotu sports. It kind of ties into the idea that women athletes are being sexualized in order to keep them under control....if that makes any sense...
Name: missie
Username: mtidwell@brynmawr.edu
Subject:
Date: 2003-02-25 16:54:32
Message Id: 4835
Comments:
umm...that last comment was posted by missie who was incapable of correctly making a post...lol
Name:
Username: sshomste@smith.edu
Subject:
Date: 2003-02-26 02:39:56
Message Id: 4841
Comments:
I watched Blue Crush for the first time in our class but I have friends who saw the film in the theaters and there reaction to the film seemed to be the same as mine:this was a typical hollywood film that cute blonde women in string bikini's to make money in the box office.
Ann Marie story of being a struggling surfer didn't seem realistic, especially after she is given instant sponsorship and a cover of a magazine in the end.The film mostly focuses on a relationship with a man who "inspires" her so that she is able to overcome her fears and succeed.It's insulting to think that she needs some guy's "support" to perform well as if she doesn't have the strength within herself.It was similar to Monica's story in Love and Basketball.
Overall, I didn't feel that the film had much substance to it and seems like another cheesy flick.
Name: Melissa Teicher
Username: mteicher@brynmawr.edu
Subject:
Date: 2003-02-26 12:37:05
Message Id: 4845
Comments:
At first the film portrayed the main character as getting up at the crack of dawn and working her butt off for this big competition in seven days. However, that is the only portrayal of her working hard and training. The rest of the images are of her in hotel rooms, at parties, living the life with her rich temporary boyfriend. It's great that the outcome was that she got a great mark on the wave she surfed and got on the cover of a magazine. But the events leading to the final competition seemed unrealistic and too much like a fantasy. You want to cast a gorgeous girl as the main athlete to attract viewers? Fine. But at least show a few more scenes of her training and working for this competition.
Name: Annie
Username: acoppock@smith.edu
Subject: Blue Crush
Date: 2003-02-26 15:47:04
Message Id: 4847
Comments:
I agree that Blue Crush is your typical Hollywood movie. The beautiful blond girl, and the football player, I mean, how much more typical can you get! Although I am not discrediting surfing as a sport, I don't think that it was portrayed as a sport in the movie. Ann Marie competed in a big event, and we only saw her training once, at the beginging of the film. It was unrealistic that she was given sponsorship right away. I feel that there is alot of emphasis on her body,but not in an athletic way. Although Ann Marie wanted to be the first women on the cover of Surfing magazene, I doubt that many people would see it that way. I think that many people would see the cover and think about how "beautiful" or "sexy" she is, and not think of that fact that she is the first female on the cover.
As for the steroetypes of the charecters in the film.... Ann Marie and her friends are portrayed as wild and uneducated. The other female native islanders at the hotel party are definetly sex symbols. I wonder if the dancing is an accurate depiction of traditional Hawaiin dancing, or Hollywoods own idea.
Name: Rianna
Username: Anonymous
Subject: cover
Date: 2003-02-26 22:18:30
Message Id: 4853
Comments:
I think it would have been an advancement for women in sport if it had been the winner of the competition on the cover of the magazine, not the main character. I think a movie about the winner (I can't remember her name) would have been much more interesting. She seemed dedicated to the sport, to trying once and then trying again, to train hard, and to pass it on to others (all within the context of this unrealistic film, of course. She may not have been a stunner, but she had what counts--talent. As it was, the cover of the magazine in the film was like the Sports Illustrated picture we saw in class (the golfer in her undies), a sexy woman first, and only then an athlete.
Name: Sara
Username: sshomste@smith.edu
Subject:
Date: 2003-02-27 00:33:48
Message Id: 4855
Comments:
As was discussed in class, there is a barrier that is still in place for women in sports.We accept men as athletes first, yet atheletes that are "female" athletes are female first. This is one of the main reasons why "Blue Crush" needed Ann Marie to be sexy and beautiful and wearing a bikini. Her athleticism came second to her sex appeal in the film and its sad that our media perpetuates this problem in sport for women.
Name: millie
Username: mgentry@smith.edu
Subject:
Date: 2003-02-27 00:53:26
Message Id: 4856
Comments:
I agree with the previous posts that suggest that Love and Basketball and Blue Crush project a distorted image of female success. In my opinion, an asterisk should be placed next the definition of female athletic success depicted in these films, for both Love and Basketball and Blue Crush imply that a female athlete cannot be successful on her own. According to these films, a female athlete will only thrive once she has achieved romantic success. More simply, Love and Basketball and Blue Crush suggest that a female athlete will attain success only when she has the support of a romantic male partner. Monica is unable to take pleasure in playing basketball until she rekindles her romance with Q. Similarly, Ann Marie is able to surf the pipe until her boyfriend lends his support. Additionally, I would argue that the primary focus at the end of both Love and Basketball and Blue Crush is not on the athletic success achieved by the female protagonist, but the union of a heterosexual couple. This is obvious just studying the imagery of the films. As such, I feel that these films only serve to promote the antiquated notion that a woman is nothing without a good man at her side, and do not promote a positive image of a successful female athlete.
Name: Ingrid
Username: ihansen@brynmawr.edu
Subject: love and basketball
Date: 2003-02-27 06:19:00
Message Id: 4859
Comments:
"Love and Basketball" did a fantastic job of presenting inequity of resources and attention to men's/ women's sports. The construction of the families was a good device to illustrate cultural ideals. Q's family placed mother and father into materialistic beauty and macho breadwinner roles: women are kept out of the realm of sports, functioning as sexual objects (so indicated by Washington's character's infidelity). Monica challenges Q's ideas of feminine and sport, and although he admires her, he cannot come to a true acceptance of blending the two until the conclusion of the film. Monica's family acts out on a small scale what Monica encounters in her life as a ball player. She has a supportive father, but a mother who cannot relate to Monica's passion and dismisses the notion that basketball can be a serious pursuit for a woman. The film ends on an ultimately uplifting note, with Monica's participation in the WNBA. However, one gets the sense that had Q not been "humbled" by his injury, we wouldn't see such support from him.
In the latest issue of Mother Jones, there is a blurb about "Built to Win: The female athlete as cultural icon" by Leslie Heywood and Shari Dworkin. It consists of interviews with girls and boys, readings of ad campaigns, discussions of movies, and personal stories to illustrate what we do with strong female athletes in our culture. Sounds particularly applicable to this course, if anyone is interested in checking it out.
Name: Ingrid
Username: ihansen@brynmawr.edu
Subject: blue crush
Date: 2003-02-27 06:19:57
Message Id: 4860
Comments:
"Blue Crush" runs rampant with stereotyped figures, not only with gender but with race as well. The main character and her friends played out like the Barbie diversity model: the white character is the center of attention, but she also has cool "ethnic" friends supporting her; Barbie comes with many accessories, including a friend of every color and a kid sister. The visiting football team serves up another platter of race stereotypes--the trim (skinny, even?) good-looking white guy quarterback is thrown into relief against the "big loud jolly black man." The quarterback is serious, respectful, and neat whereas his friends are ready to play the fool, and the film makes quite a point of showing how dirty/ disrespectful they can be. The girlfriends of the football players are shallow catty bitches (if I may--that is how the film directs us to think), serving no purpose other than to denigrate the main character and her friends, and present the stereotypical whore figure.
Just to bring up some relevant material... I don't know if anyone has ridden the R5 recently, but I saw an advert for ESPN that presented 5 smiling cheerleaders. The caption said: "Without sports, they'd just be dancers." Ladies, we have quite a way to go.
Name: mahnoor
Username: mahmed@brynmawr.edu
Subject:
Date: 2003-02-27 14:52:47
Message Id: 4867
Comments:
Blue crush presents a group of young girls whose lives revolve around surfing. Even though the main character makes it to the cover of a surfing magazine, it comes as such a struggle to her. She meets the football player, loses track of her "priorities" and in the end asks him what he would do in her situation. Though it all adds up to her eventually building character through adversity, its as if the biggest challenge she has to face is deciding whether she can be someone's girlfriend and a committed athlete at the same time. And though this question rises for her, it doesn't necessarily bother her boyfriend. The movie does return to the main character's personal struggle to succeed in the end. However, it isn't her friend's consistent concern that brings her back to her senses. Its the realization that her boyfriend is soon leaving town. Had no one commented on her similarity to the Denny's waitress, it is debatable whether she would've realized her mistake in time.
Name: Jackie
Username: jpiltch@brynmawr.edu
Subject: Blue Crush
Date: 2003-02-27 15:19:09
Message Id: 4869
Comments:
I see no advancement for women in sport when the main character of Blue Crush is the first woman on the cover of SURFING magazine. She is only the sweetheart of the surfing world, not a surfer who has actually accomplished anything with skill. Maybe this is because I know her background. She almost never practiced, partied all the time with her football player boyfriend, yet somehow performed fantastically at the competition? And her performance doesn't even compare to the ones of the professional surfers, who actually worked hard to get to that competition. The woman who won the competition did not appear on the cover of SURFING magazine. No, that cover, the first female cover in the history of the magazine, had to go to a beautiful girl, America's surfing Anna Kournikova. Thank god we had the opportunity to watch a movie for this class that upholds all the double standards we're trying to overcome.
Name: Katherine
Username: kquah@brynmawr.edu
Subject: Week 4
Date: 2003-02-27 16:14:23
Message Id: 4870
Comments:
Question 1
I don't think that it is an advancement for women in sport that the character is the first woman on the cover of the magazine--just because she is a woman doesn't take away from the character of the individual that we know (someone who rarely practiced, etc.). If this was on a more individual scale, then maybe it wouldn't matter who she was, but because she is the first woman, it takes on a whole different amount of importance, especially since she is in some way, representing women. Not to say that what she achieved isn't worth something, it definately is, and while it's exciting that a woman is on the cover, one wishes that it was a different woman.
Name: Amy
Username: astern@brynmawr.edu
Subject:
Date: 2003-02-27 16:59:45
Message Id: 4872
Comments:
For this movie to have been an advancement for women athletes, we would have to have had a woman worth respecting. Instead we got Anne Marie, who was more interested in her gratuitous heterosexual relationship than in her sport.
It's completely understandable that the producers didn't aim to make the great American movie. They wanted a movie that provided girls in little to no clothing. They cast the "star" of Young Americans in the lead. No one presumed that they'd tell a story particularly worth sharing. But if anything, this went AGAINST women in sports. Just watching the movie made me feel like I'd regressed ten or twenty years in the women's movement.
Blue Crush had all the elements of a good mindless movie: very pretty people; homosocial, if not homoerotic, interactions; a trophy boyfriend; a contest the main character will somehow succeed at no matter what. If it had managed to pull these elements together, perhaps it wouldn't have been such an offensive movie.
If only.
Name: Jennifer
Username: jfichter@smith.edu
Subject: The Cover Photo
Date: 2003-02-27 22:50:40
Message Id: 4879
Comments:
I first saw Blue Crush in the theaters reluctantly, because my boyfriend wanted to see it. I had seen the trails on television and thought it was another stupid movie for males to drool over women's bodies and I was never going to go. When we left the movie theatre, I absolutely loved it and he hated it. I still think it is a good movie.
I do think it is advancement to women athletes that Anne Marie appeared on the cover of SURFING. She is the first women on the cover and her cover shot depicts her celebrating her excellent ride. Anne Marie is not pictured with men or family, just herself competing. Most shots of women athletes are taken with men or dressed up as super models in beauty magazines. Seeing a cover shot of female athlete in action is advancement. However, I do think the winner of the competition, having earned a title is more athletically deserving of a cover photo. On the other hand, Anne Marie is now the newest member of the Billabong tour. It does show that she exceeded expectations and accomplished her goal of surfing Pipeline, becoming sponsored by Billabong and managing to overcome a traumatic sports injury.
Name: Amy
Username: amelanso@smith.edu
Subject: Blue Crush
Date: 2003-03-01 19:33:25
Message Id: 4887
Comments:
I originally saw Blue Crush in the movie theater with my mother. We were in the mood for a good ?chic flick? and that is exactly what we got. We got to watch some nice scenery, a cute love story, and some cool surfing shots. The notion of athleticism in the movie was undermined by the romantic relationship that developed between the male and female main characters. Furthermore, the way in which Anne Marie was depicted reinforced the stereotypes that are presented within mainstream media and society in general. The film industry produced yet another movie with the ?image? that sells: a beautiful blonde woman that meets Mr. Right, Mr. Support, and Mr. Has All the Answers and falls in love with the implication that everything will be ok because there is a man there to pick up the slack when things are tough. The stereotypical heterosexual relationship that is acceptable is seen yet again.
Furthermore, I was disappointed at how surfing as a sport was presented in general. When the principal of Penny?s school confronted Anne Marie, the principal made reference to how Anne Marie used to be smart and had all this potential and why was she wasting her time on surfing. It is very interesting how the director played out this particular scene. Men in general are never told that they are wasting their time pursuing a career in sport where women, on the other hand, are highly discouraged and thought of as incompetent for doing so. In Love and Basketball. Quincy was highly discouraged by his father from leaving college to get drafted into the NBA. However, the emphasis was on the argument that "can't" is not in a man's vocabulary and not so much that Quincy was incompetent.
In addition, we never saw Anne Marie really training, as one would expect an athlete of her status and athletic competency to do so. We saw Anne Marie as a maid, as a nurturing sister in the making, and somewhat as a slacker. We also saw a character that possessed a lot of fear. It is almost as if society is uncomfortable with allowing women to be fierce, strong, self-sufficient, and to truly be told that ?they got game.? Even though Anne Marie did finish strong in the competition and got her picture on the cover of SURFING magazine, the movie ended with her in the arms of a man.
Not only did the movie do a great job at stereotyping the women in the movie, but the men were portrayed in a skewed fashion as well. The two black football players were presented as disrespectful, womanizing, goofballs. I think that this not only reinforces American racial stereotypes, but also it exemplifies Bell Hook?s talk where once again black men are depicted as constantly in motion, wound up, and in a sense ?out of control.? When I responded to last week?s question, I ended my response with ?we are living in a different consciousness even though some things have stayed the same.? After seeing this movie, I am not so sure about that statement.
Name: Claire Mahler
Username: cmahler@brynmawr.edu
Subject: blue crush
Date: 2003-03-03 19:24:03
Message Id: 4914
Comments:
How does this movie stereotype?
How does it not??
I suppose I'm not the average 'chick flick' viewer; I generally try to steer away from them because I get easily frustrated with flat/shallow characters who show no real emotion or motivation for what they do. Although Blue Crush showed many breathtaking shots of the setting, I would have to say that this film is definately on my list of movies that I don't need to see again any time soon. Sure, on the surface it seems like the lead is single-handedly overcoming her fears, excelling at a strenuous sport, taking care of her sister, and forming a lovely romantic relationship simultaneously...look a little deeper. Not only are the women pigeon-holed to being the sexually desirable figures relatively incapable of doing much of anything, but even the [usually spared] male characters aren't shown in a particularly flattering light. Either they're bullies or unthinking characters driven by heterosexual desires.
I understand that filmmakers create such trite and meaningless movies in order to placate the general public, but is the situation of our country's intellect so grave? Can we really not handle anything of substance? I am both horrified and ashamed if that is indeed the case.
Name: mahnoor
Username: mahmed@brynmawr.edu
Subject: WEEK 1 POSTING!
Date: 2003-03-17 12:42:57
Message Id: 5024
Comments:
Week 1 question:
What is the cultural ideal of women in sport? How does it differ from men?
Though advancements such as Title IX and the excellence of female athletics in many sports has increased the possibilities available to the present and future generations of women in sports, cultural stigmas are still attached to a woman pursuing an athletic career.
With changing times and ideals, it wouldn't be incorrect to assume that most parents are encouraging of their daughters to enjoy the benefits of having athetic ability and talent. However, there is still a hesistance to commit a woman completely to her sport. For a man, he can be represented as only a basketball player or just a soccer ball kicker. But for a woman, she must also be accompanied by justifications of her sexual orientation, fertility and good ol' commitment to a decent, family lifestyle. Women are finally being awarded their due right to opportunity, however, the domain of sports is still claimed to be inherently for men.
Name: mahnoor
Username: mahmed@brynmawr.edu
Subject: WEEK 2 POSTING!
Date: 2003-03-17 14:15:42
Message Id: 5025
Comments:
Week 2 question:
What is the meaning of the images used in the popular media that portray women? Portray women athletes? Give some examples of positive images and some negative images. Look at the WNBA website for an interesting look at the intersection of media and women's professional sport. www.wnba.com
The media plays a very active role in construing facts for their audiences. Images, with the right coloring, angle and editing, are capable of telling a story more powerful than words themselves sometimes. The media is also dictated by the dominant part of the society that showcases its biased opinion as the ultimate fact. Women athletes have to compete for airtime for their games, for advertisements and for publicity with their male counterparts. Though men are portrayed as athletes first, and everything else later, representations of female athletes are on the opposite end of the scale. In popular media, an occasional insert shot of a great jump or shoot will be overshadowed by overtly feminized representation of female athletes. That is not to state that female athletes have no business being feminine. However, pictures dileanting their sillhoutes, lighting them up as objects in little clothing as opposed to athletics with beautiful, flexible bodies are a bit too obvious and redundant.
There are of course the magazines that portray female athletes as athletes. These magazines portray the athletes not as women with women whose sportamaship is an isolated aspect of their existence. There are pictures of women sweating, brusing, bleeding, excelling, overachieving and making history. However, they are also superimposed by the images of her cooking, sewing, gardening or taking care of her children. Such impressions wouldn't be entirely horrendous if they didn't completely ignore the fact that these women are amazing athletes that serve as role models for generations to be. For example, there are various pictures of female athletes "in motion" on the court on the WNBA website. However, in their portrais, only one pictures sports an athlete wearing a loose tee of their team. The remaining 16 portray breezy, fancy and dressed up athletes with no mention of their basketball ability or interest. Only 3 pictures show the athletes holding or sitting on the ball (never shooting it). I wonder why none of these superstars wanted to show off their jerseys?
Name: Rianna
Username: Anonymous
Subject: were there any week 5 questions?
Date: 2003-03-17 21:06:23
Message Id: 5037
Comments:
I was wondering, since I couldn't find any, if there were any week 5 (A League of Their Own) questions to which one could respond. I felt that the film did a reasonable job of portraying the events of women in baseball at that time period. Since, however, I have not researched that era (American history is not my interest) I would not be able to say where the movie was historically inaccurate. The concept of women's baseball, and the formation of a women's league, was an advancement of women in sport. It is a great shame that the leagues were closed down when the men came home. It could have been a massive step forward for equality in sport if the women's league had been able to coexist with the men's.